B.S.F. Forum - A Bravenet.com Forum

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 3, 07 - 6:28 PM

The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Might not want to make so many plans on that. A lot of people I know are voting no on this bond. Curious as to what you might vote and why.

I for one am voting no on this new jail. The reasons are as follows:

#1 They have already proven to be irresponsible with the funds allotted to them in the first place, no need to throw more money at them

#2 Their negligence on the current jail got us into this pickle, let them solve it

#3 I believe IF the bond gets passed they will come back and say there were costs they did not anticipate and get more money out of us

#4 I believe they will also raise property values in the west side due to this new jail and get more taxes out of the residents over there

mam

IP: 75.31.15.130

Oct 3rd, 2007 - 6:57 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

will also vote no for same reasons

*!*

IP: 70.249.172.21

Oct 3rd, 2007 - 9:42 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

I think the jail commission requirement for cell space per prisoner is 94 square feet. Let's say 100 square feet to make the math easier. 96 beds x 100 sq ft = 9600 sq feet. I've heard the proposed jail is going to be 40,000+ square feet!

I'm fairly sure a jail only facility with an exercise area and visitor room could easily be built across the street to the west of the courthouse. A kitchen, laundry, etc. could be built on the VACATED 4th floor of the courthouse. The sheriff's offices could be housed on the first and fourth floors. Meals could be walked by jailers across the street in hospital type food service carts. It's what, maybe four miles round trip from the courthouse to the proposed jail site. How much will it cost to drive to and fro for the next 50 years? A heck of a lot more than $500,000 would be my guess.

Brownsville, Texas has recently opened the state's first tent jail facility, and, yes, it has been approved by the jail commission. If tents are good enough for our soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan...

11.5 million is what it will supposedly cost to build the new jail. How much will it cost to operate it? How much will taxes really go up. How many individuals driven out of the county? I know one retired couple already wanting to repair to more friendly taxed ground. Let's not forget that businesses, when they are able, will pass through the tax increases to consumers, which means higher food prices, rent, etc.

ME!!!!!!!

IP: 75.111.211.87

Oct 3rd, 2007 - 10:29 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

JE there is one more to add to the list.The location is wrong.There is a perfectly good empty half block north of the court house.I am talking about that STOOPID Heart of the City Park.We have a nice City Park (if the parks
department would take care of it.)
By the way My hubby and are voting NO also.

jfk

IP: 208.180.187.121

Oct 4th, 2007 - 2:11 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

our town leaders think they can achieve anything they desire but i would not be surprised in the least if something has gone terribly wrong downtown that they are trying to keep hidden from the rest of us. both the city and county are both all of the sudden broke. they have recently stopped pounding alon in the media like they have been, i think it may be due to the fact that alon might have recieved some information regarding the real reasons the county is trying desperately to raise their and everyones taxes. alon has obviously stopped the county dead in its tracks and has them a bit scared. but you know what, they, our city leaders, are going to be terrified when other things come to light in the near future. i do hope the town fathers read this and i am sure that they will deny everything in this letter, especially the problems that they have recently encountered from various agencies in the last few months. let them deny it all they want because right now they and i know the real truth. don't we?

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 4th, 2007 - 6:02 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

I have been encouraging as many people as I can to vote no, we all need to do the same.
Because I am sure the city officials are going to encourage as many as they can to vote yes.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 4th, 2007 - 7:15 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Are you guys serious. I have a wonderful idea. Lets take all the cash we can and throw it in the god**** bonfire tonight. When is everyone going to wake up. THE COUNTY NEEDS A NEW JAIL! PERIOD! ******* DUH! Yeah yeah yeah, they got themselves in this. Whatever. Our jail sucks. Always has, always will. I don't think these guys and gals built the **** thing. At least they are trying to fix it. There are a million excuses to not build one. No **** sherlock. All of those stupid reasons do not fix the problem, and this IS a problem. If anyone here truly is voting no based on the excuses listed above, do us all a favor and move to Stanton..or Alaska. This town sucks ass because of people like you. Never want to progress and move forward. At the rate we are going, we are going to get a 4 bed jail that costs $127.4 million. I hope the bond gets passed. I hope the jail gets built. I hope that anyone who doesn't like it packs their **** and moves to another town. I will even help you pack. Good riddance. Move somewhere where everyone enjoys status quo, and we will all stay in Big Spring and try to make it a better and more modern place.

P. friggin S. Is everyone on this site OK with all the money spent to house inmates elsewhere? Guess what dip****s, that money will have to come from somewhere....HMMMM...wonder where it will come from...geez....I have no idea. Get...a....clue. We will pay for it one way or another.

P.S. friggin S. I am retracting my wishes. I hope that the bond fails and they use the certificates of obligation just to make you guys mad.

Sorry everyone, I missed my meeting with my therapist, and I had to get it out somewhere.

Thank you for listening. **** off.

Rita

IP: 75.110.247.213

Oct 5th, 2007 - 11:08 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

HolyCrap,
I agree with you that we need a new jail...I just question the jail they want to build.

Before he took office, I personally gave Judge Barr information about pre-cast (or pre-made or modular ..what ever you want to call them) jails, along with a quote for the cost. It was a LOT less than the cost of the jail on last years ballot and CERTAINLY this years estimate. I hear all kinds of good things about steel buildings. They have not asked for public input about the jail. I've made FREQUENT comments and suggestions about the jail at the commissioners meetings with no response from anyone.

When I called the Judge's office yesterday, I was told there would be a town meeting on the 16th for the public to ask questions. At that time the secretary was not aware of any other meetings scheduled. This gives us only about 2 weeks to decide if we like this proposal or not....just like last year...every thing was presented at the last minute as though they don't want to give you much time to think about it...JUST DO IT!!!

As I said. I DO think we need a new jail, I just don't see how they think we are going to afford THIS jail with all the other taxes, etc. that are being put on us. I don't understand how a city of less than 20,000 can afford the cost of the proposed jail when 20% of the ciitizens earn poverty level or below.

And, considering the gross neglect of the current jail, why should we give them another one to neglect??

20/20

IP: 70.249.172.186

Oct 5th, 2007 - 11:20 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Boy I am more convinenced than ever that I better vote yes for a new jail and higher property taxes. It is so enlightening to read the words of an individual with such a command of the English Language and thus able to convert people like me with their persuasive arguement. Kinda makes you proud to live in a community that has such a rational, progressive and free thinking neighbor in our midst.

jfk

IP: 75.110.242.141

Oct 5th, 2007 - 11:47 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

over the years i have learned that when people discover that other people know how they really are and what they stand for they will hate and despise them and attack them with every hurtful thing that they can muster. what they are obviously experiencing is plain, pure and simple PANIC. like satan, they also are now aware that their time is getting short. i agree that we do need a new jail. i also think that we need more businesses to come to big spring but it seems every time we have that chance our town fathers will do everything in their power to keep it out. especially if it means they might lose a dollar or two. i am sorry that holycrap felt it was necessary to try and attack the people of this community. i understand his/her frustration regarding this whole situation. it has effected alot of us this way but the plain simple truth is that our town leaders are only interested in serving their own interests. they betrayed our trust a long time ago. now something is going to be done and when the truth finally comes out, and it will come out, we can then pick up the pieces and hopefully get our town back in order and then big spring will prosper. so you see, holycrap, the people crave progress and hope but the only way we will get it is to take matters into our own hands and refamiliarize our town leaders about the law and how it works. the guilty will be humiliated and punished as will their lap dogs who do their bidding.

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 5th, 2007 - 3:52 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

With such intellegent debate, I sure am glad to know which side of this issue you stand on HC.

*!*

IP: 70.249.172.21

Oct 5th, 2007 - 4:41 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

According to this

http://www.brownsvilleherald.com/news/tent_73573___article.html/prisoners_lucio.html

article, the Cameron County Sheriff and the Cameron County Commissioners [proactively] built a 48 bed tent jail for non-violent offenders for $20,000 (twenty thousand dollars): that's less than the cost of a new patrol car! Why didn't we do the same here &when our jail was closed???

Few would argue that we don't need a new or refurbished jail in Howard County. We surely DO NOT need a Sheriff's Castle/ Taj Majal Jail! A "jail only" facility located downtown is obviously the way to go if we want to build a new jail and economize. Why on Earth do we need to duplicate space 2 miles from the courthouse? What will we do with the 4th floor of the courthouse if somehow the citizens of Howard County allow our elected representatives to build a 96 bed 11.5 million dollar Taj Majal Jail???

Tax Situation Comparison:

A property owner with a 2007 taxable value of $100,000
in the City of Midland will pay ~$2270
while a the owner of a $100,000 property in Big Spring will owe ~$2903.

I fear that a new $11.5 million jail and the ongoing costs to maintain and operate it will cause taxes on a $100,000 property to rise appreciably.

The 2007 tax rate for Midland County is .230505 per $100 valuation while the 2007 tax rate for Howard County [not including the cost of the new Taj Majal Jail] is .487870 per $100 valuation. Midland County's property tax rate is half that of Howard County's: if you are ok with raising our the county tax rate to perhaps .65 or .70 per 100 valuation, go ahead and vote for the Taj Majal Jail.

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 5th, 2007 - 4:45 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

It would be one thing if we weren't already taxed outrageously, but this is just getting out of hand. Howard College recently got the bond for 21 million I believe.
I always suspected they charged people to go to college to help cover maintenance costs as well. Turns out I was wrong.

I agree with *!*, a tent city would be much more cost effective. And might serve as a deterrent to crime as well.

*!*

IP: 70.249.172.21

Oct 5th, 2007 - 4:53 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Has anyone done the math on the proposed Howard County Jail:

$11,500,000.00 divided by 96 beds =

$119,791.67 per bed!

That's outrageously, outlandishly expensive!

Compare to the Cameron County tent jail:

$20,000 divided by 48 beds =

$416.67 per bed.

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 5th, 2007 - 5:08 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

That is a great point *!*

LBJ

IP: 75.110.242.141

Oct 6th, 2007 - 12:20 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

why dont they do like that sheriff in arizona does....big tents large fence...cots and bologna sandwicheshow much would that cost?

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 6th, 2007 - 5:43 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Yes. You are all correct. Lets put them in tents. And you all wonder why I get ****** to the point where I rant like a madman. You guys are truly stupid. All of you.

Why don't you guys go get tents and move out to Moss Creek Lake. Let the sane do the decesion making around here.

**** off.

Rita

IP: 75.110.247.213

Oct 6th, 2007 - 9:01 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

HC, I sure wish I'd used your mehod to try to sway people to my way of thinking...you are SOOO eloquent.
I'm sure you've enlightened many on this board with you mastry of the English language...NOT!!!

Perhaps if your pleas FOR the new jail speaks for those who think it's a good idea...no wonder there are so many opposed

Stating one's opinions on issues is OPTIONAL on these boards but rudeness and uncouth posts only show your basic intellect...or lack thereof.

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 6th, 2007 - 9:15 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

HC, maybe you should just go ahead and do the good ole internet coup de grâce and offer to fight all of us.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 6th, 2007 - 9:22 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Gosh. You guys are right. Oh my god. I just threw up a little in my mouth.

That was gross.

Rita

IP: 75.110.247.213

Oct 6th, 2007 - 9:50 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

HC, that's the first correct thing I've seen you say here. Take 2 of your little pills and get back to us when you've had a nice nap

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 6th, 2007 - 10:08 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Guys, honestly, I believe this guy just want to get this thread deleted so people don't see the truth. So he wants to curse and call us all wrong hoping someone will remove his attempts at being offensive.

Ignore him and keep the thread and the truth alive.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 7th, 2007 - 10:44 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

I truly laughted out loud at that JE. There is no truth here. Only opinions. That is what is so funny around this site. It is like the same 4 or 5 people going "I agree, I agree". Then you all think it is facts. Opinions are like aholes...everybody has one.

But, hey. Ignore me. You guys can't let me squash the truth. I have been sent here by "you know who" to get this thread deleted to keep the other 3 people here from reading it.

Go eat a "New York" hot dog and smile people. You take yourselves to serioulsy. I am just glad nobody else does.

*!*

IP: 70.255.99.221

Oct 7th, 2007 - 2:16 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

$119,000/ bed for the new jail? What a joke! Are the fixtures in the Taj Majal Sheriff's Castle to be made of gold instead of stainless steel? Flat screen televisions and pay per view movies?

Why didn't our sheriff, county judge, and county commissioners come together and build a tent facility like Cameron County? A county tax rate twice as high as Midland County isn't nearly high enough?

Psst,

, remember that you heard it in this "unimportant forum" first:

A

1000' TSUNAMI

IS COMING!

JE

IP: 69.152.132.8

Oct 7th, 2007 - 2:48 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Don't they aready have 2 jails as it is here? The one at city hall, and the one at the police station, why can't they rennovate and update both?

But I agree with you whole heartedly on this one *!*

jfk

IP: 75.110.242.141

Oct 7th, 2007 - 5:02 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

greetings all. i see that i have missed holycrap's enlightening wisdom regarding the jail these last few days. shame. but since we are on the subject and "HC" seems to have unlimited knowledge perhaps he could clarify a few thing's for the rest of us mentally challanged individuals. question number 1. since our esteemed, honorable town leaders, this includes the city council as well as the rest of the governmental bodies, have only the best interest in mind for the city and county and want to save money everywhere it can so it won't have to take drastic measures like eliminating job's and so forth, why will they not consider alternative plans to save alot of money. to anyone with an i.q. above 5 a tent city jail makes perfect sense. if i am not mistaken jail is suppossed to be a place of punishment. our soldiers over sea's have no problem with living in tent's. question number 2. how did both the city and the county both become broke at virtually the same time? i know the answer to that but i would like to hear yours or do we need to wait for you to confere with them first? we'll just start you off with 2 question's for now. the tougher questions will be saved for our honorable leaders to answer later on after they have been sworn in. in answering these questions i would appreciate it if you would answer like a man or woman instead of your panicky ravings. it's not just the jail "HC" that will be answered for but this will do for now.

ME!!!!!!!

IP: 75.111.211.87

Oct 7th, 2007 - 9:23 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Sheriff Joe is at it Again

Please read to the bottom!!! It is awesome and if every state did something like this or sent them to Sheriff Joe I bet crime would drop.

Oh, there's MUCH more to know about Sheriff Joe!

Maricopa County (Phoenix) was spending approx. $18 million dollars a year on stray animals, like cats and dogs. Sheriff Joe offered to take the department over, and the County Supervisors said okay.

The animal shelters are now all staffed and operated by prisoners. They feed and care for the strays. Every animal in his care is taken out and walked twice daily. He now has prisoners who are experts in animal nutrition and behavior. They give great classes for anyone who'd like to adopt an animal. He has literally taken stray dogs off the street, given them to the care of prisoners, and had them place in dog shows.

The best part? His budget for the entire department is now under $3 million.

The prisoners get the benefit of about $0.28 an hour for working, but most would work for free, just to be out of their cells for the day. Most of his budget is for utilities, building maintenance, etc. He pays the prisoners out of the fees collected for adopted animals.
I have long wondered when the rest of the country would take a look at the way he runs the jail system, and copy some of his ideas. He has a huge farm, donated to the county years ago, where inmates can work, and they grow most of their own fresh vegetables and food, doing all the work and harvesting by hand. He has a pretty good sized hog farm, which provides meat, and fertilizer. It fertilizes the Christmas tree nursery, where prisoners work, and you can buy a living Christmas tree for $6 - $8 for the Holidays, and plant it later.

Yup, he was reelected last year with 83% of the vote.
Now he's in trouble with the ACLU again. He painted all his buses and vehicles with a mural, that has a special hotline phone number painted on it, where you can call and report suspected illegal aliens. Immigrations and Customs Enforcement wasn't doing enough in his eyes, so he had 40 deputies trained specifically for enforcing immigration laws, started up his hotline, and bought 4 new buses just for hauling folks back to the border. He's kind of a "Git-R Dun" kind of Sheriff.

Update on Joe Arpaio

TO THOSE OF YOU NOT FAMILIAR WITH JOE ARPAIO

HE IS THE MARICOPA ARIZONA COUNTY SHERIFF

AND HE KEEPS GETTING ELECTED OVER AND OVER
THIS IS ONE OF THE REASONS WHY:
Sheriff Joe Arpaio (In Arizona) who created the "Tent City Jail":
He has jail meals down to 40 cents a serving and charges the inmates for them.

He stopped smoking and p orno magazines in the jails. Took away their weights Cut off all but "G" movies.

He started chain gangs so the inmates could do free work on county and city projects.

Then He Started Chain Gangs For Women So He Wouldn't Get
Sued For Discrimination.

He took away cable TV Until he found out there was A Federal Court Order that Required Cable TV For Jails
So He Hooked Up The Cable TV Again Only Let In The Disney Channel And The Weather Channel.

When asked why the weather channel He Replied, so They Will Know How Hot It's Gonna Be While They Are Working
ON My Chain Gangs.

He Cut Off Coffee Since It Has Zero Nutritional Value.

When the inmates complained, he told them, "This Isn't The Ritz/Carlton.....If You Don't Like It, Don't Come Back." (I LIKE THIS ONE)

He bought Newt Gingrich's lecture series on videotape that he pipes into the jails.

When asked by a reporter if he had any lecture series by a Democrat, he replied that a democratic lecture series might explain why a lot of the inmates were in his jails in the first place.

(I think he is a "non partison" Republican) ( note: the sender of this email -me-did not adopt a dog)

More On The Arizona Sheriff:

With Temperatures Being Even Hotter Than Usual In Phoenix
(116 Degrees Just Set A New Record), the Associated Press Reports:
About 2,000 Inmates Living In A Barbed-Wire-Surrounded Tent Encampment At The Maricopa County Jail Have Been Given Permission To Strip Down To Their Government-Issued
Pink Boxer Shorts.

On Wednesday, hundreds of men wearing boxers were either curled up on their bunk beds or chatted in the tents, which reached 138 Degrees Inside The Week Before.

Many Were Also Swathed In Wet, Pink Towels As Sweat Collected On Their Chests And Dripped Down To Their PINK SOCKS.

"It Feels Like We Are In A Furnace," Said James Zanzot,
An Inmate Who Has Lived In The TENTS for 1 year. "It's Inhumane."

Joe Arpaio, the tough-guy sheriff who created the tent city and long ago started making his prisoners wear pink, and eat bologna sandwiches, is not one bit sympathetic
He said Wednesday that he told all of the inmates: "It's 120 Degrees In Iraq And Our Soldiers Are Living In Tents Too, And They Have To Wear Full Battle Gear, But They Didn't Commit Any Crimes, So Shut Your D amned Mouths!"

Way To Go, Sheriff!
Maybe if all prisons were like this one
there would be a lot less crime and/or repeat offenders.
Criminals should be punished for their crimes - not live in luxury until it's time for their parole, only to go out and commit another crime so they can get back in to live on taxpayers money and enjoy things taxpayers can't afford to have for themselves.

Sheriff Joe
was just reelected Sheriff in Maricopa County, Arizona.

If he can do it why can't we?

Rita

IP: 75.110.247.213

Oct 7th, 2007 - 9:54 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Because until the citizens of HC wake up and take control of government again, we are stuck with the "good ole boy" system we currently have and have had for MUCH too long....that's how we got into the trouble we are currently in.

BS and HC will not come out of the 19th century until we clean house.

JE

IP: 68.94.153.151

Oct 8th, 2007 - 8:01 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Very True Rita! And by all means, if we can get 2000 voters in our favor next mayoral election, Russ will be long gone!

Don't seem like it will be much of a stretch with the way they are handling things, let them sink themselves, then remind the citizens of their errors before the next election.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 9th, 2007 - 1:20 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

This is to ******* much. I swear to you guys, I swear on my mothers grave...I am laughing while tears stream down my face.

This is more entertaining than anything on TV.

jfk

IP: 208.180.187.121

Oct 9th, 2007 - 11:49 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

i guess you could not get approval to answer the question's put forth to you "HC". that is a shame. regardless your response in it's self say's alot so you go right on trying to convince only your self that the rest of us are "nuts" and we will go right on with taking our town back and making sure that if there was any wrong doing or God forbid anything illegal going on down there we will make sure the guilty parties and their little lap dog's are held accountable. it is nice to have out of state friends who know the law real well. have a nice day.

JE

IP: 68.94.153.151

Oct 9th, 2007 - 12:14 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

He/She never was going to answer the question, they aren't here to add, they are here to detract.

However now I suspect they will answer so they don't look so called out. Which is a shame, because HC's post count is going up at an alarming rate and that disturbs me because he's a moron.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 9th, 2007 - 6:14 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Why I make it a point to never engage idiots with conversation, I will answer your questions only because I love watching all you guys get your undies in a wad with every post I put up.

1. A tent city jail is not a cosideration because it is the dumbest idea of all time. The only way you could make it worse is if every citizen agreed to live in a tent as well, and we all ate pork and beans for every meal while reading field and stream magazine. That may save money, I will not argue that point, but I am sure that at some point there are a large list of things that are cons instead of pros. What if a prisoner becomes ill due to sleeping in a tent. Say he dies. Say the county gets sued. Say we have to pay a criminals family millions because we choose to house our inmates in....tents. Plus, how trashy would that look. I bet it would look a lot like the trailer parks in Nevada that houses thousands of Indian Americans. Who needs that eyesore?

2. From the best of my knowledge, the city is not broke. The county is. I AM NOT CLAIMING TO KNOW ALL AS IT RELATES TO THIS. So before you go off on a tangent, I admit to knowing nothing about the city's financial affairs. So...the county is broke because...wait for it...housing inmates elsewhere. Surely this not the only reason, but it is the biggest.

Look. We...need....a...new....jail. Not tents, not fixing up the old one. There is no magic fairy dust that will fix that. Nobody here can dispute that. If you do, then you are living in la-la land. Why are you beating around the bush? Bite the bullet..build a new jail. When your fridge craps out, what do you do when repair is no longer an option? I bet YOU put a tent in your back yard and fill it with dry ice, then store all your goods there. The rest of us go buy another one. I don't like it. I don't like having my taxes increase. Duh. Nobody does. But that is life. The longer this is put off, the worse it will be...just like herpes!

To JFK: Nobody really cares who you are friends with, and for the record, findoutaboutlawsinotherstatesbecauseiambored.com does not constitute a "friend". You represent the shinest spot in this whole sea that the whole town laughs at. You think tents are a great idea, and you have a whole slew of theories that laws are being broken. You are a prime example of why nobody takes you or anyone on here seriously.

To JE: My posts are going up at an alarming rate. I am willing to bet that everyone is as troubled about this as you are. If I am all you have to worry about, then you lead a pathetic life. Oh, and one more thing...while you are wishing for 2000 more votes that will never come...will you get me a pony as well?

To Rita: BS and HC will not come out of the 19th Century until we actually start making progress. Ya know...like building current facilities around here.

To !: I don't think jails are priced on a per bed basis. Guess what, my house costs about $40,000 per bed, and I am paying for it all by myself!!! Sounds pretty stupid doesn't it?

There ya go boys and girls. Now post away to bash me, just like I know you will. You guys are my puppets, and you will continue to get upset and post as long as I do. Or you will ignore me. Do you have something to say, or are you going to shut up. LOL.

That was fun!

jfk

IP: 75.110.242.141

Oct 10th, 2007 - 12:46 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

to "HC". obviously someone cares who our new out of state friends are or they would not keep sending you here to dispute everything with, as usual, no logical answers other then we are all stupid here. i do enjoy your sense of humor though. you are almost as funny as some of the reporters that work for the locally controlled newspaper here in town. as for a prisoner dying in jail, you might want to do a little research on our current jail and see that over the years we have had our fair share of deaths and suicides there. i don't remember any big payouts to the families of those people. perhaps you could enlighten us on that. as far as your posting goes, believe it or not that is a good assett. i'll let you figure that one out for yourself. regardless of what is said or disputed the clock is ticking and it's only now a matter of time before everything will be brought out in the open. will you still jump for your master's when all is revealed? to je, rita and "!" and all other concerned citizen's, keep your chin's up because help is coming. jfk

*!*

IP: 75.18.53.94

Oct 10th, 2007 - 6:16 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Holy Crap wrote, "To !: I don't think jails are priced on a per bed basis. Guess what, my house costs about $40,000 per bed, and I am paying for it all by myself!!! Sounds pretty stupid doesn't it?"

$11.5 million is the [supposed] total construction cost of the proposed new jail. Evaluating the number of beds we will get at a specified cost is one way of better appreciating the true cost. Surely you aren't so believing as to buy that a 10' x 10' cell and its supporting spaces should cost anywhere near $119,000??? A jail-only facility should be built downtown with the supporting spaces [kitchen, laundry, sheriff's offices] remaining in the courthouse. I'd wager than many prisoners would prefer the relative freedom of an al fresco low risk tent facility compared to the 10'x 10' jail cell. I certainly do not advocate mistreating prisoners. $119,000/ bed is ASTRONOMICALLY expensive, and Howard County's tax rate is already twice that of Midland County. Finally, HC, are you even the least bit concerned with the true M&O costs for the new facility? If I'm not mistaken, the Jail Commission warned Howard County not to build a jail with the expectation of paying for it by renting cells to other counties. Go figure.

Thanks for the encouraging note, jfk.

JE

IP: 68.94.153.151

Oct 10th, 2007 - 6:31 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

You guys are giving this HC way too much credit. He apparently wants to be taxed even more. I wouldn't say he is a thinker by any means.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 10th, 2007 - 7:00 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

OK.

1. To dispel any theories or fairy tales, I do not work for the city, county, or any goverment agency. I am no way associated with anyone related to the topic, so JFK, put the bong down, and quit thinking the man is out to get you. I have one master. It is Tony Romo.

2. JFK, I really wish you would quit with the talk of help coming, and things being brought out in the open. You are scaring me. OOOOOHHHHH....help is on the way. What, are you getting 2000 voters to come here?

3. As far as deaths go, I am sure that any deaths related to our current jail facilites have nothing to do with keeping prisoners in unfair conditions.

4. To "!", I am really starting to think that you are the only one on this site with brains. I disagree with you on this topic, but you at least sound like someone I could sit and enjoy a cup of coffee and conversation with. As far as the tent jail theory goes, I have tried to do some research on it because, in all honesty, I am vague on the whole situation. From what I can find so far, it seems like a temp set up, not permanent, so it does not seem like a feasable solution. Not sure on that though, I am digging more. I am thinking of personally emailing Adon Munoz and ask his opinion on the matter to further educate myself on it. I don't think the jail should be paid for my renting space, but we currently STILL have to pay money to house inmates elsewhere. A new jail will swing that in our favor, plus it is a long term fix, not short term. Like I said earlier, we will pay one way or another because we will have to pay more taxes to house them elsewhere if we don't build a new jail...which brings me to...

5. JE. You...and....me....and....JFK...and...."!" everyone....will pay more in taxes if we don't build a new jail. We will all pay more taxes if we do build a new jail. I don't have to be a thinker to get that, and since you don't get that what does that make you? Should we fix the problem or not?

6. If we are going to build a new jail, why not build one that is worth it. The last time one was built, they went with the bare essentials, and that left us with the mess we have now. It was a bad idea then, and it is a bad idea now.

Everyone here can talk about my "grasp" of the english language, you can talk about who sent me here, and what my intentions are, but here are facts, not opinions.

1. The county is broke. A large part of this has been jail issues for repairs and housing inmates elsewhere.

2. If we build a new jail, by bond election or not, taxes will go up.

3. If we do not build a new jail, we will continue to house part of our inmates elsehwhere, and all of them if they shut the jail down again. Taxes will go up with either of these scenarios.

Pay one way, or pay another, but rest assured, we will all pay. I guarantee it. That is why I am in favor of fixing the problem since it is going to cost me anyway. 11 million dollars? Fine! Just build a jail that will last and remain relevant for many years, and not be dated in 10.

By the way JFK, you are...and I am being honest here...one of the strangest people I have ever encountered. I am willing to bet the sixties were faaaaarrrrr out man. Get back on the meds before they come and get you.

JE

IP: 68.94.153.151

Oct 11th, 2007 - 7:59 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

1. The county is broke. A large part of this has been jail issues for repairs and housing inmates elsewhere.

False. We are still housing inmates and we had millions in a "rainy day fund" for this, the millions have not been spent in just housing inmates.

2. If we build a new jail, by bond election or not, taxes will go up.

Of that I have no doubt, more reason to rid ourselves of current spenders....I mean leaders.

3. If we do not build a new jail, we will continue to house part of our inmates elsehwhere, and all of them if they shut the jail down again. Taxes will go up with either of these scenarios.

Unless we rennovate the TWO jails we already have for a fraction of the cost of building a new one.

Pay one way, or pay another, but rest assured, we will all pay. I guarantee it. That is why I am in favor of fixing the problem since it is going to cost me anyway. 11 million dollars? Fine! Just build a jail that will last and remain relevant for many years, and not be dated in 10.

Why build a new one since they can't take care of the two they already have?

And finally

3. As far as deaths go, I am sure that any deaths related to our current jail facilites have nothing to do with keeping prisoners in unfair conditions.

If there aren't unfair/substandard why replace the jail? Good job negating yourself.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 11th, 2007 - 2:15 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

I didn't negate myself. Take more than 1 second to process what I said and you will realize that. I am to tired to explain it to you.

*!*

IP: 70.246.65.54

Oct 11th, 2007 - 11:23 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

JE wrote: "Why build a new one since they can't take care of the two they already have?"

Excellent point, JE.

Holy Crap, Do you agree that $119,000 per jail bed seems a bit excessive?

JE

IP: 68.94.153.151

Oct 12th, 2007 - 11:37 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

It is excessive. And the other two jails were new at one point weren't they? Or did they just appear from nowhere aged? The leaders have proven themselves to be negligent with upkeep to jails, so please explain to me why I should have to foot the bill once again, for something that your track record shows you will neglect to the point of little to no solvency.

Vote No on Nov. 6th

Rita

IP: 75.110.247.213

Oct 12th, 2007 - 11:53 AM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

AND...if it does get voted in, I think they need to appoint a civilian board to verify that maintenance IS done on the building and safty issues are monitored and passed.

The other floors in the current building are VERY well maintained, so why did just ONE floor fall into such disrepair?

FP

IP: 69.55.193.59

Oct 12th, 2007 - 12:51 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

just vote for it or pay another county to build thier new jail with your money, thats what your doing now.

FP

IP: 69.55.193.59

Oct 12th, 2007 - 12:54 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

Rita
its not a maintenance issue, its a issue there isnt enough space, not any space for females, the things an antique and is outdated and unsafe.

JE

IP: 68.94.153.151

Oct 12th, 2007 - 5:41 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

It IS a maintenance issue. It wasn't until it failed state inpection that this was brought up again. They Have 2 jails, I would vote for a bond in the amount of 5 million to rennovate, update, and add a little more room.

But sorry, 11 million to build a new jail that will one day leave us in the same situation due to their lack of desire to appropriate funds needed to do basic maintenance. I think not.

I would say these guys spend money like drunken senators, but that would be insulting drunken senators.

Rita

IP: 75.110.247.213

Oct 12th, 2007 - 9:24 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

FP...if you re-read my post I stated that if IT, meaning the jail, gets voted in, we have to monitor maintenance on it so systems don't malfunction and the building doesn't deteriorate before it should.

jfk

IP: 75.110.242.141

Oct 14th, 2007 - 12:35 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

greeting's everyone. i see the debate continues. "!" good job on pointing out the ASTRONOMICAL cost that this jail will put on everyone. i believe if it is passed rita we better have an independent counting team there to verify that no "fixing" was done. i mean, after all, the mayor won by a landslide. wink wink. i agree with JE, we are going to have to pay regardless of what is done but i, and i think everyone would agree, would rather pay the least and get the same results then have only one option and one option only. actually HC the 50's were pretty cool. if i were to have a "bong" as a relic from that era i would name it "TJ" (that's pronounced tee-jay HC) in honor of my favorite dog. i'm kind of sentimental that way. with regards to scaring you with talk of our out of state friends HC i assure you that no one here has anything to be legally afraid of and that includes you. unless.... tony romo isn't your real master, and may he lead the boy's to victory over new england today. another thought that crossed my mind with regard to the jail is this. there are several thousand trailer's just sitting on several different lot's for what was suppossed to be used for the katrina victim's. i will look into the cost of them, if the government has any type of programs that would possibly benifit us. i'll let you know something in a few day's. just a thought.

FP

IP: 69.55.193.59

Oct 15th, 2007 - 12:47 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

It is going to get even more expensive by delaying another year if we dont vote this one in. Geeze i really do agree that the cfommissioners Should have done things years or decades ago to prevent this situation, but they didnt. I see they wont make the decision now either, so WE as responsible citizens must vote for this new jail NOW, or be faced with another closed jail and nothing but more bills to pay for. I keep hearing it said like this,
" we are building a new jail right now- we just dont get to have it in Howard County"

JE

IP: 68.94.153.151

Oct 15th, 2007 - 12:51 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

So you just would like for your taxes to go up even more and give a group of people another jail.

Despite their PROVEN track record of not taking care of the other two jails currently built. Quite frankly, at this point, I don't want the new jail at all. I am tired of my money bailing them out of the tight spots they self impose.

Having something NEW isn't the argument here. Hell, a new car will blow up if you don't change the oil.

Holy Crap

IP: 75.110.246.205

Oct 16th, 2007 - 8:56 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

I attended the town hall meeting tonight. I am curious as to what the argument against the jail is now. I don't know if anyone here attended as well, but here are a few things that I learned from the meeting.

1. A tent jail is not a viable option.
2. The cost of the jail is resonable and well thought out.
3. The cost has nothing to do with a per bed way of thinking.
4. Building this jail will be cheaper right off the bat than not building it.
5. Upkeep of the new jail has been thought out and addressed.
6. Renovating the other jails is not an option.

So I am curious, what is the argument? I am not being a smart ass by asking. I am truly trying to educate myself on the 2 sides of the issue.

I personally feel there was an overwhelming case made for the jail bond issue to pass tonight. Did any of this info from tonight change anyones mind, or answer any questions?

"!"...I am really curious to hear your thoughts on the issue tonight. I am certain that you were the one asking a majority of the questions, as they were good questions that seem to stem from your thoughts on here, and I mean that as a compliment. If I am mistaken about that fella being you, my apologies.

2020

IP: 65.70.108.186

Oct 16th, 2007 - 11:18 PM

Re: The Commissioners Think They Have The Jail In The Bag

The town hall meeting tonight was certainly a game of solitaire. There was no opposing view presented from the stage and the vast majority of the fifty people there were either City or County employees and their spouses. The stage looked like a mock kangaro court with Bill Crooker, Emma Brown, Gary Simer and Jerry Kilgore sitting like stuffed dolls in a childs bedroom, unable to move a muscle in their faces or say a single word to or for their constituients. Mark Barr fliped flopped like a man who has sold his soul cheap and had the body language of an animal trapped. The collection of representives from Austin looked and presented themselves more like Kelley Grimsly sales people then the kind of professionals you'd expect to be holding such high posts. The architect was great and a man proud of his work. But on the whole, it was a one sided show, filled with good little germans, laughing at bad jokes, cringing at the few people who dared ask questions and leaving the theatre beleiving they had won a battle. But in a game of solitaire, who do you beat?

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